With no attempt at SPAM meant, I was wondering if Ken would like to take a peek at my Site Build It http://www.andrewgoulding.info/site-build-it.html review.

It’s not substantially different from any of the comments I’ve made here but a few words from Ken (with a LIVE link to this blog, of course) would be pretty cool.

ADG

PS. The whole site should be revamped/SILOd via XSitePRO 2 soon and can then be promoted properly.

Andrew Gouldings last blog post..Xango 3SIXTY5: The Video

Hey, Alex, when I first replied to this, it was because you had given a measured review to blogorbuild.sitesell.com … thoughtful comments. I just liked the way your write. And I see that is YOU all the way through. You continue to do that, not only in this thread, but throughout an excellent blog.

And I agree… blogging is perfect for you. Please understand that I’m not trying to convince YOU that you should be using SBI!, no way — that would do you a disservice. You have found your perfect milieu.

My main point in blogorbuild is that blogging is the wrong way for most small business people. The blogosphere has this HUGE disconnect from the real world, the place where regular business gets conducted every day.

And while bloggers have wailed about that Web page in some threads, none have bothered to actually, intellectually, systematically dismantle the reasons that I present. They just utter emotions, rather than reasoned debate. And you, Alex, present a balanced, thoughtful review. I admired the thinking that went into your post.

I was talking to one blogging pro the other day who said…

“Ken, you’re right, of course. There’s really only a few of us who make money. But who’s going to really admit that?”

Just to be clear, Alex, my reply above, part of it was to you and part was to other people who had repeated some of the myths of SBI!. And speaking of myths and “graduating”…

Andrew, we know some folks can’t take what SBI! requires you to do… “work differently.” We know they feel so strongly that they don’t have the total flexibility to work exactly the way they used to. That’s the price of success.

SBI! is a step by step process. You have the flexibility you need to succeed and just the stories in our forums this morning and yesterday in the forums would make you wonder what there is to graduate to.

What more is there than leading a life of passion, of freedom, on your own terms, without fighting all the tech barriers along the way?

Some folks DO want to do different types of sites. Like I said, if you want to create snipshot.com, you don’t com to SBI!. If you can’t get past the fact that you work differently, well that’s OK. I don’t want you to be unhappy in your work, but I’d suggest you reassess priorities.

And if you feel you’ve learned well from SBI! and can do the next one without SBI!, too, that’s great, too. But there are tons of power users who say, “Sure, I could do it without SBI! now. But why in the world would I want to? All the tools and time saved with SBI! and the value of the replacement tools I’d need?”

So there are two sides to every story, and who knows why people really write what they write? All I know is…

Andrew, there are tons of folks who build huge sites and successes, who feel no need to move them elsewhere. That may have been the case before we released a variety of compatibility modules and Infin It!, but unless you have very special needs (and those folks are not our target market), most small business people will never need to “graduate.”

Meanwhile, they are living lives they had only dreamed of before.

THAT’s what excites me, every day. And I think it’s the big picture that so many people miss.. or don’t believe.

All the best,
Ken

P.S. Alex, this is a great blog. You have an active group of commenters and your present regular, frequent fresh thinking. A great example of blogging the way it should be done.

Frankly, I dearly wish I had become an SBI member myself, back in 2004, when I first got interested in commercial uses of the web…I’d have saved myself a bundle and would still recommend SBI to anybody.

However, over the years, I’ve see a number of posts at different forums by ex-SBI users who used terms stronger than “clunky” to describe SBI…and that they eventually moved on to other web builders, after gaining a great education from SBI. Just reporting from the trenches.

Andrew Goulding

andrew gouldings last blog post..Xango 3SIXTY5: The Video

Once again thank you for taking the time to comment!

I have admitted I don’t know a LOT about SBI!, simply because I never owned it.

I agree that you Business Model offers a superb value and “clunky” was not my comment. I think of it more like a standard web layout that offers simplicity combined with functionality. As long as it performs (and your owners numbers are proof of that) – it works.

I also am not familiar with everything your system has to offer and do not make claims that I know it. I simply state that what you offer, supported by the detailed information that accompanies it – will be educational, as long as people willing to take that time to learn. Which brings us to …

“Expectations” – in my comment this was mentioning not specifically SBI owners expectations but great many people who start working online. People expect to see returns fast while your system is built on stability and consistency, which is the best way for long term. Unfortunately I see it time and time again where people look for a quick hit wonders, a system that will make them rich right away and personally – I haven’t found one that works like that.

And reminder to myself – be more clear in my comments

Once again, Ken. My post or comments are NOT meant to bash your system as compared to WordPress but to stress importance of evaluating personal needs before making decision what is right for you! I still would recommend your system to 5 out of 10 people… BUT

I still stick with WordPress which is personal decision based on how I use it and what I expect from it.

Ken Evoy again. A couple of comments…

1) Quite the contrary re “expectations.” Please see our mascot…

http://tortoise.sitesell.com/

We work hard to make expectations reasonable in more ways than our mascot. That said, some may start that way, but I’d say that “regular” hosting and “would be bloggers” start with FAR MORE unreasonable expectations. Alex, read our “How I Found SBI!” thread in the forums and you’ll see what I mean. SBI! owners are serious, motivated and know what they are starting… a real business. The Get-Rich-Quick folks refund within a month and are gone — it’s a great weeding out process.

I feel sorry for most people who struggle with regular hosting and blogging before finally giving up. Those were not THEIR expectations.

2) Re SBI! being “clunky” — I don’t see why. You can build a site using your own HTML editor, Flash, etc., that is as sharp and active as any “regular” site. Our Web site “sitebuilder” ITSELF is intentionally “clunky like a training wheel bike” is — because people need real training in order to build a site that “works” for both humans and engines. You don’t need to keep using it, of course. You can use any HTML editor with SBI!.

And meanwhile, my 19 year-old daughter is very proud of her “clunky” site. It makes more money with her part-time SBI! site than most Web pros do online.

I saw a hilarious thread the other day where “experts” were talking about “moving up” to WordPress, etc. One SBI! owner raved about SBI! and never came back. His site, by the way, was far from clunky. Then I checked the Alexa, Quantcast and Compete traffic numbers of all who had posted, including the most “authoritative-sounding” experts. The SBI! owner had the best numbers in the entire thread… by far. And this person was just an average person who had started SBI! 2 years earlier with SBI! (and yes, had quit the day job).

Most folks spin their wheels and lose money on the Web. THAT’s the sad part of all this.

3) “Graduation” — you can “graduate” from SBI! if you like. But I’m not sure what you want to graduate to. If you’re not completely familiar with all that SBI! does, take a look at tools.sitesell.com. Unless you want to start your own “next big thing” with your own custom programming, etc., etc., there’s nothing you can’t do with SBI! that you can do with regular hosting. Especially now that you can add anything you like onto your successful SBI! site using Infin It!. Yes, we encourage folks to use that module to plug in modules like forums, etc., from REGULAR hosting.

We don’t reinvent wheels, we use them. So for folks who want or need more… AFTER they have built a site with good traffic and IF they need more, they can do ANYTHING with Infin It!. And more to that…

4) “Web 2.0″ — We don’t consider SBI! sites to be islands. They are more and more advanced. Certainly Content 2.0, which is SBI!’s Web 2.0) is way ahead of blogging. Read the threads by SBIers who create Content 2.0 environments — what they achieve is staggering.

There is inadequate knowledge and understanding of all that SBI! is and does.

For example, Alex, your site comes up on one of my feeds for SBI! for sitesell or whatever, every now and then. So do SBI! sites — they are all RSS-fed. And their Content 2.0 participation by users augments that even more.

Then they can add third party Web 2.0 projects like Ning.com and since they get thousands of visitors per day by that time, Ning takes off for them, instead of doing what it does for most of users… sit idly with their friends passing by to say hi every now and then (50% of Ning’s traffic comes from 50 Ning sites out of 300,000).

Sorry… I think there’s a lot you don’t know. SBI! does more than cover the basics better than any other product, enabling folks to actually succeed at building BUSINESSES. It enables even the most sophisticated to take advantage of all it has to offer, and all you can do with it and add to it, that you’d rarely feel the need to graduate.

And if you do feel the need, say “thanks” and send us someone. We’ve changed SO many lives along the way, as you’ll read just about every day in the forums. People actually quit their day jobs, travel the world, etc. Elad’s story moves me profoundly…

http://www.my-sbi-adventure.com/

Is the above site a little clunky? I guess so. But that’s his choice.

Does he care?

No. He left his cubicle long ago.

All the best,
Ken

Ken Evoys last blog post..Powerful Practical PREselling Launches!:5 Pillar Affiliate Report #323

First of all – thanks! I was quite surprised that ken took the time and do greatly appreciate it as I have outmost respect for his work even though I don’t agree with all he is saying.

I think you mention very valid points and I agree that for great many it can be educational, if the person is willing to take that year. Problem is, and I mean it is a big problem – too many have unrealistic expectations.

While I think that you, Ken & Raj all have very valid points, I feel that none of you mentioned SBI’s real ace, which is that it provides a 12 month internet marketing education for $300, all costs included + (and it’s a big plus), a really enthusiastic community that you can learn from.

Best of all, with a slow exponential earning, your $300 may well be reimbursed by the end of those 12 months…and your site may even be in the black!

My heart aches when I see the big ticket “web education” products currently being rolled out for $1000-$5000, which aren’t worth a fraction of what SBI can provide (if you do the work).

Mind you, after a successful year with SBI, many folks would want to branch out and spread their wings with better looking and less clunky technology but for a first site, SBI is incredible. I recommend it wholeheartedly.

Andrew Goulding

Andrew Gouldings last blog post..Xango Glimpse Skin Care: A Second Teaser With Beverly Hollister

Input from the people who have experienced both sides of the fence (so to speak) is invaluable. I have to agree that SBI might be a better fit for conventional business but if they want to take advantage of social media, Web 2.0 to connect to their customers on personal level, establish more trust … I feel that SBI can’t deliver it to same extent as WordPress.

Sorry Ken I still stick to my original thought – SBI is great but in its own space, it can replace the blogging but blogging can greatly enhance and in right hands replace SBI site. But it has to be in the RIGHT HANDS.

I would like to share some thoughts on this post.

I have to agree that blogging is the greatest thing that has happened in the internet community-building.

But, as is well known, success through blogging, especially, business success, requires one hell of a lot of hard work.

Blogs are like small kids. They crave for attention all the time.

Actually, in Jan2006, I stepped into the internet business world with a website using SBI. Today, I have some 7 or 8 sites (including blogs) but I have found that the SBI site really is not at all demanding.

I did not give due attention to the SBI site for almost 18 months but still my SBI site has grown to give me around 300-400 visitors per day. Since last two months, I have again started giving it the attention it deserves.

For conventional small business people, I feel SBI is the best bet as I doubt they will be able to handle the pressures of business blogging.

As an affiliate, I promote both SBI as well as Web 2.0 related products. I will have to tell you that I have seen good success promoting SBI.

Cheers
Raj

Dennis Edells last blog post..New Category – FREE Marketing Membership Sites